Messianic Lies

 

 

 

This is a follow up about the Christian Evangelists who pose as ‘messianic jews’. The original post was called ‘The Missionary Position’.

 

This is to address a few queries I have received:

 

 

1 Yes, of course Messianics have  every right to their own beliefs, rituals and practices.

They just don’t have any right to call it ‘judaism’. Because it isn’t.

 

2 The Messianic movement is a very specific Christian Evangelical movement.

It does not represent all Christians. Indeed, many Christians have spoken out in condemnation of the Messianics and their lies when they pose as ‘jews’.

 

 

 

Countering The Lies Messianics Tell About Judaism:

 

 

 

 

Messianics often try to convince Jews that yes, they ‘can remain Jewish and worship while practising Christianity’.

This is simply not true.

Some ex Messianics have spoken of how they  received  organised training in just *how* to debate genuine Jews. They  describe how they actually attended seminars and mock discussions.

 

 

Here are some of the most common arguments that Messianics tend to use:

 

 

Messianic: “lots of Jews have  found Jesus, and are now “Jewish Christians”

 

 

FACT: A Jew who becomes a Christian = a Christian.

Nobody can be both Jewish and Christian: it’s a theological contradiction. The two faiths contradict one another on many things.

 

A Jew who adopts Christianity as their religion is an EX Jew.

They are not ‘a jew for jesus’ any more than a Hindu who becomes a Christian is a ‘hindu for christ’.

Judaism does not permit dual religious identity.

You are a Jew or you are a Christian.

You cannot be both.

 

 

 

Messianic: “Lots of Jews are ethnically or racially Jewish, but Christian by faith.’

Note: This is one of the most common arguments used by Messianics.

FACT:No such thing as being ‘racially‘ Jewish. Jews are not a ‘race’.

It was Hitler that tried to persuade the world that Jewish people were a separate race but it was a lie then, and it is a lie now.

You can’t change your race, but you can change your faith.

 

 

Nor is Judaism an ‘ethnicity’. How can it be? Which one ‘ethnicity’ unifies all Jews?

An Indian Jew is not the same ethnicity as a Japanese Jew. A Japanese Jew is not the same ethnicity as a Black Ethiopian Jew.

A Black Ethiopian Jew is not the same ethnicity as a Swedish caucasian Jew.

There are Jews of *all* ethnicities!

 

 

And what we share is the Jewish religion.

 

 

 

Messianic: “Messianic ‘jews’ are simply Jews who know the truth about Jesus.”

 

 

FACT: 98% of Messianics were *literally* never Jews to start with. Not via birth. Not via conversion.  Not via faith. Not via theology. Not via worship. Not via heritage.

If they aren’t Jewish according to Judaism’s criteria, then they are not Jewish – period.

Judaism and only Judaism gets to define Jewish identity.

Just as Christianity and only Christianity gets to define Christian identity.

 

 

Messianic: ‘But Jesus was Jewish – so why don’t Jews worship and accept him?’

 

 

FACT: Joseph Smith, founder of the Mormons, claimed to be a Christian. Does that mean all Christians should be worshipping him? Clearly not.

 

Woody Allen is Jewish as well. Does that mean if *he* claimed to be the maschiach we should believe him?

Let’s say Woody Allen did declare that he was the Jewish messiah. Let’s say a small group of Jews believed him and began worshipping him.

Would they still be practising Judaism?

Answer: no, of course not!

Now apply the same logic to Jesus.

 

 

 

Messianic: ‘Religion is a personal thing. I have every right to define myself as Jewish.’

 

 

FACT: It’s a private, personal thing until you then enter the public arena and claim to represent a religion that you don’t belong to. You don’t have any ‘right’ to hijack the very word ‘jewish’ and then lie about what it represents.

 

 

Judaism has defined Jewish identity the same way for thousands of years. You don’t get to REdefine ‘judaism’ to suddenly INclude practising either Christianity or any other faith.

 

An analogy:

I can wake up tomorrow and announce I’m a Native American Indian! Does that make it true?

Do I then have the ‘right’ to MISrepresent what Native American Indians stand for, in public forums?No, of course not. And you don’t have any ‘right’ to do it with Judaism!

 

 

Messianic: ‘Jesus was Jewish. Therefore if I worship him, I’m Jewish as well.’

 

 

FACT: The ‘logic’ here is so flawed it’s bizarre.

 

The facts are crystal clear: if you worship Jesus as ‘christ’ and if you affirm belief in Christian ideology, you are a *Christian*. Just like if you embrace Islam, follow Mohammed, and affirm belief in Islamic ideology, you are a Muslim.

 

Let’s say Woody Allen declared himself the Jewish messiah. If you believed him, would that make you Jewish?

Answer: no, of course not!  Judaism was a complete and fulfilling faith for thousands of years before Jesus was even a twinkle in Joseph’s eye.

 

 

Messianic: ‘The ‘old testament’ refers to Jesus again and again. Jews are just too stubborn to see it.’

 

 

FACT: Given that the OT is a purely Christian text, yes, it probably does point towards Jesus.

The OT was produced by the Church, and while some versions are reliable and really good, others are mistranslated, reorganised and reinterpreted, Christianised versions OF the Jewish Tanakh.

Jews study and read the Tanakh in the original Hebrew. We don’t use any translation. And in the original Hebrew, Jesus is nowhere to be found. Jesus himself read the Tanakh, in Hebrew, just as Jews across the world do today.

 

* (note: you can find a detailed list  of some of these mistranslations in the Scripture section of this blog)

 

 

“jews for jesus”

 

 

Sooner or later someone will ask you about the infamous group ‘jews4jesus’. This is the most aggressive and well known of all the Messianic groups. Let’s be crystal clear:

 

 

‘jews4jesus’ is a Christian group. It was founded by Martin Meyer, an ordained Baptist minister.

 

 

Baptists don’t get to REdefine Judaism. Nor do Baptist Ministers  get to start a ‘new jewish sect’ that practises a form of Christianity!

 

 

Usually, Martin Meyer goes by the name Martin ‘Rosen’. He apparently feels it sounds more ‘jewish’. And at times, he claims that his parents were Orthodox Jews. This may or may not be true. Either way, it’s utterly irrelevant. Even if he started out a Jew, Martin Meyer exercised his right to leave Judaism, and to convert to Christianity.

 

 

Among the members of ‘jews4jesus’ there are a few former Jews. The key word here is of course: former.

 

 

If a few Jews convert to Islam – does Islam become somehow ‘jewish’?

No, of course not.

 

 

If a group of Jews become Hindus – does Hinduism now equal ‘judaism’?

No, obviously not.

 

 

Same applies to Christianity. Just because a few EX Jews are now Christians, this does not make Christianity somehow ‘jewish’.

Be aware: members of ‘jews4jesus’ are slick, quick and very practised at answering Jews who are trying to expose their lies.

One of the group’s favourite claims is:

 

 

”The original followers of Jesus were ‘messianic jews’. We’re no different’.

 

 

Just remind them that firstly, only a tiny sect of Jews ever followed Jesus. And the minute they affirmed belief in the ‘resurrection’ and in the notion that Jesus was anything BUT a normal mortal man, they were effectively *leaving* Judaism.

And the original followers of Jesus never practised Christianity because it did not exist until long after Jesus died. The rituals and beliefs of ‘jews4jesus’ has little in common with those who were part of the sect headed up by Jesus.

You might also like to point out that even if Jews were the first disciples of Jesus, it’s irrelevant. Consider: The first Australians were Brits. Does that mean that today’s Aussies get to REdefine British identity, customs and laws?